Carley, Doc, Townsend, and Lucy on Dating

I said yesterday that I wouldn't post any more Michael John Carley quotes. I lied! Or, more accurately, there's more in his book that I want to interact with. In Asperger's from the Inside Out, Carley offers some tips on dating. I'll list his tips and respond to some of them, drawing on other things that I have seen, read, or experienced.

"Part of where we have a legitimate shot at someone being attracted to us lies in our ability to bury ourselves in work that we love and believe in--and then being seen doing it. So find some of that work, and if you sense that in this capacity there's no one there for you at your present volunteer position, move on. Volunteer somewhere else, and keep trying until you have some luck" (183).

Carley relates that this is how he met his wife, Kathryn. She was a journalist in Iraq, where he was working on bringing water to poor areas. She was attracted by his passionate commitment to his cause.

Believe it or not, there were times in my life when this could've worked for me, but I kind of blew it. In the course of my academic career, attractive (and not-so-attractive) females have remarked to me, "You are so smart!" Some of them even had conversations with me. Maybe if I had been more confident or socially savvy, I could have gotten dates. But I was really shy.

Right now, I'm usually not so lucky. I find it difficult to stand out in academia now-a-days. And a lot of my work is solitary, so women don't see me doing it. I do write on a Christian dating site, which has news and Bible study forums. I wish women there would be attracted to me through my brilliant writing, but, alas, I've not had much luck.

A friend of mine at Harvard once told me that, even though I wasn't that successful in getting dates then, I would one day shine in academia. And if a woman saw me being passionate about my work, then she'd figure that I could be passionate about her. He said that I'll probably meet a colleague in academia or the ministry (if I choose to go that route).

But there are rules that I'll need to remember! As a professor, I cannot date my students. And, as a pastor, I cannot date my parishioners. It's against the rules.

What Carley says reminds me of a sermon by Lucy Camden on 7th Heaven. I'm in the 9th season right now, and Lucy is an associate pastor at her father's church. Her father wants her to teach a class about abstinence, since a nearby church has an extensive sex ed program, plus his son, Simon, is getting sexually active in an attempt to bury his pain. Lucy talks about the Shulammite woman of the Song of Songs, who knows who she is and doesn't need others to feel good about herself (in Lucy's interpretation). According to Lucy, we should seek out our own passions rather than looking to a man or a woman to fulfill all of our needs.

And this was the advice that I heard at GRASP. I remember one young man there who was obsessed with finding a girlfriend. He was advised to get his mind off of girls for a while and find himself some interests, like a course of study (for instance). C.S. Lewis gave the same advice about seeking friendships in general: Don't complain about not having friends! Rather, find something to be interested in! Then, you can build some friendships around those interests.

What I just said here will prove important later on in the post, so store it in your memory banks!

"Rituals like dinner, dancing, and/or a movie shouldn't be ruled out necessarily, and if you can do well at such traditions, a certain amount of pride should be yours for figuring them out (I couldn't). But if these venues are not to your liking, Grasp's Zosia Zaks, in Life and Love: Positive Strategies for Autistic Adults, has a fabulous list of date ideas..." (184-185).

The list includes having a picnic; hiking; and visiting a museum, aquarium, or science center (as Bill did on his first date with Hillary).

This is an important point. My Harvard friend whom I mentioned above prided himself on being a ladies man. He said that women like to be surprised. If I give a woman the same red rose over and over, he said, then she may get bored with me and not stick around. And so it's good to be creative in the dating game.

That's something to think about. I ordered Zosia's book for this reason. Plus, it offers strategies on seeking employment, so I'm sure the book will be useful to me on numerous occasions.

"Prior to the date, dress appropriately and smell good. Perfumes or colognes aren't necessary (and if the other person is on the spectrum, it might be preferable that you not wear these). But make sure you're clean--teeth brushed, no body odor, etc." (185).

I've recently found out how important this is. Don't get me wrong: I've always brushed my teeth, bathed, and put on deodorant. But here's the deal: Recently, I went home to Brazil, Indiana and got a haircut. When I came back here to Cincinnati, I got compliments. A gay person I know said, "You look different. You look clean-cut and handsome." My therapist said, "That's a good modern haircut! You look like you're taking better care of yourself! You're clean shaven, and your clothes are neat. You look like you're going to a job interview!"

And, interestingly, more attractive women have smiled at me. Ordinarily, they don't even look at me when I pass them on the streets. Now, for some reason, there are more who acknowledge my existence (though I haven't had any conversations with them).

I'm not sure how to take the part about looking different. I've shaved and bathed for as long as I've known these two men. So I'm not sure how to stay clean-cut. What specifically do I need to do now that I didn't do before? Do I need to get regular haircuts? Tuck in my shirt more? What?

"At the beginning of the date, say something nice about how your date looks. But don't keep repeating the compliment" (185).

This resembles dating advice that I've heard from Doc Love, a dating guru whose advice has helped many. According to Doc, women like men who are a challenge. They generally don't like men who fawn all over them. That's why Doc recommends that men not call a woman the day after he met her (or went out on a date for her, for that matter). Rather, he should wait a week. That's a rule I've violated a few times!

I seek balance on this whole issue. Doc says that men should be somewhat aloof and let women do the chasing, but I don't think that's the best strategy for me. I've been aloof most of my life, and that's not gotten me too many dates! Women may like their space, but they also appreciate men who find them attractive. A lot of women work on their appearance an awful lot, so they want to know that their efforts are successful. And so Carley gives a good guideline: compliment her once, but don't fawn all over her throughout the date. She likes to be complimented, but she also likes men who are a challenge.

"Listen to the person you're on a date with. Try not to interrupt" (186).

Overall, women like to talk. This can help me on a date, and it can also annoy me. It can help me because I don't have to carry the whole conversation. I just need to come up with good questions and let her do the talking (without coming across as an interviewer). But will I be truly interested in what she has to say? Well, that may be a determining factor on whether to take the relationship to a deeper level!

"When the topic switches to you, try to be positive. If the subject touches on events in your life that were hard, be honest about them, but don't play them for sympathy. You'll get more respect this way" (186).

Some say that the sympathy card actually works. And, in some cases, it may. But I'd venture to say that most women want to be with someone they respect. They are attracted to confidence. This is a struggle for me, since I have a hard time coming across as a strong, bold, confident guy, the type that makes women swoon.

Also, according to Doc Love, men shouldn't completely spill their guts on the first date. Women like mystery. They want to learn more and more about a man over time. Why would she want to go out with a man when she knows everything about him--after the first date?

I may be sunk here, since I am so transparent on James' Thoughts and Musings. A woman can just visit my blog and learn all about me! Plus, my blog is not always positive. Many readers can get the impression that I'm playing people for sympathy.

But my blog is a form of free therapy. There's something healing about putting my thoughts on public display, for all the world to see. Maybe that's because I've felt powerless over long periods of my life, as if others' opinions counted and mine did not. Now, I can put my thoughts into the realm of public discourse. "Here is my opinion!" my blog boldly proclaims.

Also, I'm learning new things every day about myself and life. That's why I have something to write each day! And so I am a man of mystery, on a certain level.

And, finally (under this Carley quote), I want a woman who accepts me for who I am, even if I am timid a lot of the time. Sure, I hope to build confidence as time goes on. But I need a woman with whom I can be comfortable, which (for me) means that she loves me (or at least likes me), with all of my imperfections.

"If the date involves spending money (such as dinner) and you asked the other person out, try to pay, but be prepared to pull back and let the other person contribute if you sense this is somehow insulting to them" (186).

This is good advice, especially in this era of women's lib. But it's also applicable to men who date non-feminists. I once went out with a woman who had a conservative, Church of Christ background (one of the four dates in my life), and she offered to pay for part of the meal. I paid for that date, but it's still good to have insight about such a thorny situation. The question of "Who pays?" will come up in a lot of dates, I'm sure!

"At the end of the date, never engage in anything physical unless both of you want to. If you don't want physical contact but a second date, say 'no' nicely do that your wishes are clear" (186).

This is an important rule, especially because of laws against date rape. Overall, I think that the Christian rule of "no sex before marriage" should take care of much of this guideline, even though it fails to cover non-sexual contact (e.g., kissing). Doc Love recommends that a man on the first date give the woman a quick peck on her mouth. Personally, I'd be too timid to do that!

"Remember that if you are over the age of eighteen and the other person is not over the age of eighteen, you should never, ever engage in sexual activity with that person. You could go to jail for this" (186).

This is probably a no-brainer for most of my readers, but I feel a need to stress it. One reason is that the media do not always make this clear. I've seen shows in which grown men date girls who are still in high school. It was on Desperate Housewives a few weeks ago! (Only, there, a woman slept with a teenage boy.) And how old was Laura Ingalls when she married Almonzo? Moreover, in one of Madeleine L'Engle's books for young adults, an adolescent has a romance with a college student. And art reflects life, for, when I was a teenager, I had classmates who dated people over 18. But everyone should remember that there is a serious legal consequence for those who cross the line.

Second, I've heard of situations in which men have casual sex with underage girls, without knowing that they are underage. The girls may have told them that they were 18 or more, or they simply looked older. That's why it's important to get to know someone before you have sex. Again, the "no sex before marriage" rule should take care of this (except for that Mormon sect, in which men actually marry underage girls).

"Remember to be honest if feelings start to grow. Sometimes people will date more than one person at a time unless there is an agreement between the two to be exclusive. To be dishonest in this regard is called cheating, and the other person probably wouldn't appreciate it if they found out" (186-187).

I don't have that problem yet. But I'm glad that Michael offers Aspies hope that they too can become "players"!

"If you like someone, he doesn't have to like you back. And if he doesn't like you back, then you have to leave that person alone" (187).

One has to learn to handle rejection without freaking out. Such a sense of inner-security is essential, especially if one wants to attract people. And that goes with what I said under the first quote: we need to have passions other than our obsession with the opposite sex.

Ironically, John Townsend says this in Loving People, and I was reading him make this point the same time that I was listening to Lucy's sermon. (It's funny how that happens! This has been the second time, too! See Alister McGrath on Religious Pluralism.)

So I hope that these nuggets are useful to you. Maybe they'll help me down the road!